Bonus Episode: With Great Power #209...22 Panels with Shelly Bond

Shelly Bond returns to discuss the final volume of her Adventures in Editing Trilogy:
i-DOPPELGäNGER. 

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Transcript

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Tad Eggleston: Good evening, everybody. Welcome back to 22 panels, my guest tonight, for.

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Tad Eggleston: like the 4th or 5th time now, so like you're you're coming up on the 5 Timers Club that we keep talking about making T-shirts for.

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Shelly Bond: Somebody is like shaking, shaking a step.

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Tad Eggleston: Are.

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Shelly Bond: A star-shaped tambourine.

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Tad Eggleston: I love it.

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Shelly Bond: In the spirit of who do you think.

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Tad Eggleston: Ziggy stardust.

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Shelly Bond: Liam, Gallagher.

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Tad Eggleston: Liam. Gallagher works, too.

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Shelly Bond: So great.

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Tad Eggleston: So the incomparable.

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Shelly Bond: Only Shelleyball.

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Tad Eggleston: Bond has returned.

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Shelly Bond: Woo.

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Tad Eggleston: I doppelganger. So my 1st question is, why doppelganger.

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Shelly Bond: Well, I think you're gonna have to read

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Shelly Bond: the final part of my graphic memoir editing trilogy to find out the significance.

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Shelly Bond: However, I'm going to tell you, and only you, that it's connected.

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Tad Eggleston: My listeners.

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Shelly Bond: You and your listeners that it's connected to

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Shelly Bond: the very 1st time I saw David Bowie live in concert

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Shelly Bond: in June of 1987.

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Tad Eggleston: Okay.

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Tad Eggleston: Is that enough of an answer for you?

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Tad Eggleston: I like that. Answer. How many times did you get to see Bowie live.

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Shelly Bond: Twice.

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Tad Eggleston: Okay.

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Shelly Bond: Can you believe it?

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Tad Eggleston: Do more than I pulled off, so.

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Shelly Bond: Oh, really.

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Tad Eggleston: Yeah, no, I almost got to see his 97 tour.

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Tad Eggleston: What happened

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Tad Eggleston: when he was with 9 inch nails? Well, I was 17, and I couldn't find anybody that was willing to go to the concert with me, and they wouldn't.

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Tad Eggleston: My parents wouldn't let me go down to the city on my own.

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Shelly Bond: Oh, I.

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Tad Eggleston: It might have been 96.

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Shelly Bond: I know that that old chestnut I I had same experience.

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Tad Eggleston: With clash.

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Shelly Bond: With the clash, of course, but also just with any concert. I mean, you would think when you're 17 your parents could trust you a little bit.

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Shelly Bond: Oh, prayer.

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Tad Eggleston: See my parents were even relatively good. If I had found even a friend to go with me, they didn't need me to go with an adult or whatnot. They just didn't want me going completely solo to a show that was going to get out at

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Tad Eggleston: 1130 at night on the

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Tad Eggleston: think they were playing the United Center. So the near south side of Chicago.

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Shelly Bond: Okay, you know, not easy public transportation access.

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Shelly Bond: So.

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Tad Eggleston: Yeah.

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Shelly Bond: Can you convince your mom to go with you to the show? Your mom, Chloe fan.

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Tad Eggleston: My mom was a bowie fan, but that was after my parents got divorced, so to be able for her to be able to go to show would have required us to find somebody to watch

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Tad Eggleston: my 2 younger brothers just would have been really complicated.

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Tad Eggleston: and by the time we even got close to finding it, figuring out how we might pull it off. Tickets were sold out, anyway. So you know, it was one of those like.

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Tad Eggleston: you gotta pounce.

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Tad Eggleston: Yeah. But if you're not ready to pounce, I had friends that went to that show. It was supposed supposedly an amazing show.

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Shelly Bond: Yeah, you just reminded me how young you are and how old I am. So thank you so much.

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Tad Eggleston: Not old.

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Shelly Bond: Starting off.

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Tad Eggleston: Younger than me.

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Shelly Bond: Starting off the conversation on such a good note. I'm gonna shake the tambourine.

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Tad Eggleston: Take the timber.

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Shelly Bond: Score. The score right now is Tad one Shelley. Negative, 4.

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Tad Eggleston: No, no, no.

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Tad Eggleston: because a a i mean here's the thing, though. And this this is how you feel. Young.

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Tad Eggleston: Your kid just started college. I have grandkids.

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Tad Eggleston: Okay. My kid is in his second year of college because time is elastic. That is true.

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Shelly Bond: I think it's cool that you have grandkids, because you actually got a chance to grow up with your own kids. And now you have just enough energy to be a great.

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Tad Eggleston: Actually play with the Grandkids.

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Shelly Bond: Oh, we are you a pop up, or a grandpa?

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Tad Eggleston: Grand tad.

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Shelly Bond: That is perfect, I hope.

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Tad Eggleston: Grand tad.

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Shelly Bond: I hope you have it on a T-shirt, too, if you don't.

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Tad Eggleston: Not yet, but my wife can probably pull that off. I should I should.

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Tad Eggleston: She makes all my T-shirts.

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Shelly Bond: Let's have your wife do it. I was gonna say I would make one for you. But I'm just way too busy right now.

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Tad Eggleston: You have enough on your plate you're making me. I doppelganger.

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Shelly Bond: I am.

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Tad Eggleston: And and record thieves like us, and a to Zine 31 tips for making comics, I mean.

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Tad Eggleston: as I was telling you, off air, and I'm good@firstst Everybody go to Kickstarter. I doppelganger, if you're not already backing it back it. And this is the dangerous one, because she

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Tad Eggleston: always does the best best swag in the business. So you're going to want to do your $15 for your extra swag.

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Tad Eggleston: But she also has 2 $10 zines to go with it. That both look amazing.

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Shelly Bond: Well, and they're not really Zines. By the way.

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Tad Eggleston: No, they're like.

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Shelly Bond: Cover.

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Tad Eggleston: Oh, they're hardcover, so they're not even Zines. I missed the hardcover part. I see the hardcover part 7 by 7. You're playing the whole album thing up which I love.

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Shelly Bond: Which I copied for my husband on Geezer, and Will Potter.

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Tad Eggleston: Yeah.

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Shelly Bond: Because who can resist?

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Tad Eggleston: No, it's great!

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Shelly Bond: Yeah. And I I guess now you're thinking to yourself, wait a minute. $10 for a Zine, a little steep.

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Shelly Bond: $10 for a 48. Page Hardcover.

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Shelly Bond: Printed in Korea.

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Shelly Bond: Beautiful production, quality.

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Tad Eggleston: Dirt, dirt, cheap.

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Shelly Bond: Dirt cheap because I did it just for you.

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Shelly Bond: and I wanted to make sure people could afford it. And also it's a little self indulgent. I mean, think about it. 20 records that changed my life.

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Shelly Bond: Does anyone really care?

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Shelly Bond: Got it.

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Tad Eggleston: Yes.

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Shelly Bond: God. I hope.

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Tad Eggleston: Yes, one of my one of my favorite books is Nick Hornby's Songbook.

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Tad Eggleston: which is just a collection of essays about 31 songs that are important to him.

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Shelly Bond: Oh, okay.

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Tad Eggleston: You know.

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Shelly Bond: May not like that one, though I gotta be honest. I read high fidelity, and I did not love it, and I hate it.

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Shelly Bond: The film.

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Shelly Bond: And I wasn't nuts about the TV adaptation, or whatever you want to call it.

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Shelly Bond: So yeah, maybe maybe not. But I will tell you.

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Tad Eggleston: You and Hornby, I think, would would cross over on some music, but he's got a wider swath of music that he likes.

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Tad Eggleston: I think you'd like the way he like he writes about music, though.

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Shelly Bond: Well, I'll have to check it out, and I will.

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Tad Eggleston: Yeah, I mean, it's.

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Shelly Bond: No, I mean, listen. The truth of the matter is that I

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Shelly Bond: started working on that book during the pandemic, when that 20 records 20 days.

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Tad Eggleston: Social media prompt, went around and.

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Shelly Bond: It was like, you know, in the dead of the pandemic summer, and I was as depressed as everyone, and just bored out of my mind and did it just for fun, and

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Shelly Bond: realized I wanted to publish it only when I found the amazing artist art by lid.

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Tad Eggleston: Okay.

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Shelly Bond: So origin. Story of that book is that I reached out to her.

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Shelly Bond: and I thought she probably had

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Shelly Bond: the interest in making comics just from looking at her amazing art. But I wasn't sure, and I didn't know who she was.

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Shelly Bond: She could have been 103. She could have been 23, and I thought I would hire her to do spot illustrations first, st

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Shelly Bond: and that's how powerful her art was to me.

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Shelly Bond: My eyeballs were open. They were shaking, I thought, Wow, she's amazing. Let's see what she's all about. Let's see if she's professional. And if she's interested, you know, she might hate my musical taste

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Shelly Bond: and laugh at me, which would be horrible, and I would cry.

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Shelly Bond: but it turns out she not only was into it.

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Shelly Bond: She had many of the same similar favorite records.

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Shelly Bond: She was so fast and so professional.

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Shelly Bond: and we had such a blast working on that book, that I immediately hired her to do some sequential work. So she has her 1st published comic with me in death by misadventure. 2. But we have continued working together, nonstop.

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Shelly Bond: and she's a huge part of Idoppelganger. But yes.

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Tad Eggleston: I love it.

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Shelly Bond: This is her 1st appearance in the comics scene.

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Shelly Bond: Apparently she's a big Tiktok sensation which which I only heard about through friends.

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Shelly Bond: and guess how old she is.

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Tad Eggleston: I'm looking at the picture. So I'm gonna guess 22.

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Shelly Bond: You know what I thought you were. Gonna say the same age as me, and and

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Shelly Bond: you are almost correct.

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Shelly Bond: When I hired her she was 25,

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Shelly Bond: so she turned 26, and she's just incredible. Of course, she said her mom had a pretty decent record collection which

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Shelly Bond: made me feel

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Shelly Bond: 93 years old, but her mom is a little bit older than me, which which is good, but I don't know. I guess working in comics keeps you young and immature, and I guess that's why we're so simpatico.

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Tad Eggleston: Kind of kind of like teaching high school.

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Tad Eggleston: Yeah, that's why you.

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Shelly Bond: I think that's it.

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Tad Eggleston: Yeah, I mean, I realized today that one of my one of the the teachers that I work with is closer to my daughter's age than mine.

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Tad Eggleston: like a lot closer to my dodgers age than mine.

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Shelly Bond: It's the same thing, my son Spencer is 20, so he is in age to Lindsey, who who goes by art by lib, and it's crazy. But you know it. Just when you connect with people

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Shelly Bond: on an art level.

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Shelly Bond: Yeah, especially comics as the ultimate art form.

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Shelly Bond: There's a synergy and a magic that happens

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Shelly Bond: unlike anywhere else. And so that's what I'm always going for. I like to say, to like my editing students and to people that I meet

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Shelly Bond: for me to actually sit down and write something.

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Shelly Bond: I have to be either really irritated

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Shelly Bond: or really inspired. So I get pissed off, as you know about things that happen in politics

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Shelly Bond: or just in society, that are all.

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Tad Eggleston: Did notice that you actually like got political on your Kickstarter, this time around with with comments about the possibility of tariffs throwing everything.

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Shelly Bond: Oh, well, that's just reality, you know.

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Tad Eggleston: It is reality. But I've never seen you so overtly political in public.

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Shelly Bond: Well, you know, as we know.

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Shelly Bond: we have just faced our second missed opportunity for a woman.

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Shelly Bond: Yep, you run the country, and I'm a little irritated about that, and I know there.

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Tad Eggleston: I would be. I am, too, and it's particularly irritating that, like apparently like

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Tad Eggleston: the American electorate, has decided that they'd rather have a buffoon than a woman.

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Shelly Bond: A convicted felon, you know. But whatever you know, we're gonna have to just suck it up and move forward as we did last time, and we will continue to do. But that's what I kind of like to think about when I get ready to kickstart.

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Shelly Bond: you know. Often it's an anthology. So I can get other people riled up, and we can make art

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Shelly Bond: and noise, and we can make a difference through the art form that is, comics and graphic novels, and

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Shelly Bond: an interesting thing that happened this time. As you know, because you've been so amazing at helping promote and follow not only my career, but also my husband. Phillips, career through off register press. So let me just thank you again for that, and for your support and everything you do.

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Tad Eggleston: It's not hard to support you guys. You put out such amazing stuff that like, thanks.

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Tad Eggleston: I just feel happy that not only do I get to read it, but then I get to go. Hey, shelly! That was amazing.

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Shelly Bond: Well, I appreciate that so much. But what I really wanna expressed to you here

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Shelly Bond: that's super important for me to share with your listeners is that

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Shelly Bond: you know I've been working on this

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Shelly Bond: graphic memoir editing trilogy for a number of years, you know, and I did the 1st 2 back to back.

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Shelly Bond: So I had health and grammar come out in 2022,

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Shelly Bond: and it was exhilarating to work on that book. And you probably remember I worked with Imogen Mangle, who was right out of school, and a whole bunch of friends and colleagues from all my years in comics, contributed to filth and grammar, and for anyone who's listening, real quick recap filth and grammar. The comic book editor, secret handbook is 80%. How to make comics. How I edit comics, what I look for tips and tricks.

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Shelly Bond: 20%

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Shelly Bond: comic book, short stories of my life as an editorial ingenue working my way up the ladder at DC. Comics in the Nineties

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Shelly Bond: fast Times, which came out a year later, and I was pretty good about that. I just

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Shelly Bond: kickstarted the following year, and then, 8 months later we had a book

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Shelly Bond: was the opposite ratio. It was an 80 20. It was 80% editorial antics. So

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Shelly Bond: fun times in New York city working for the bit, one of the big 2 publishers, DC. Comics in the nineties, and spending my weekends down on St. Mark's Place, buying records, reading comics until midnight on a Saturday night, going to concerts.

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Shelly Bond: and 20% editing tips and tricks of the trade because I can't help myself.

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Shelly Bond: Everything I write will always have some editing advice, because even in 2024

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Shelly Bond: it's hard to really understand what a comic book editor does. And so I just kind of want to leave my red ink

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Shelly Bond: all over anything that I touch, especially if I'm writing.

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Shelly Bond: which leads us to Idoppelganger. So the main point I wanted to make. Tad was just that.

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Shelly Bond: I don't want to say I was stalling to get this book out.

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Shelly Bond: but I've been taking my time, because this is the final part of the trilogy.

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Shelly Bond: and I want to get it right, and it also encompasses

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Shelly Bond: a quarter of a century. You know it's it's it's life as we know it, from 2,000 to 2024, which is a significant amount of time to recount

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Shelly Bond: things in comics and world events. So I. Doppelganger

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Shelly Bond: portrait of the comic book editor in the 21st Century and my Last days at vertigo.

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Shelly Bond: That's a sub subtitle Just for you.

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Shelly Bond: It's 50, 50 cause it had to be.

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Tad Eggleston: Okay. Yeah.

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Shelly Bond: 50% up and down and around the corporate ladder

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Shelly Bond: at DC. Comics in the 20th century, as digital kicked in. As

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Shelly Bond: I began working more closely with assistants, and had to learn how to delegate, and worked my way up essentially from being a full editor at the end of the nineties, but then, having to jump through the hoops to get to be a senior editor, and then a group editor.

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Shelly Bond: and then eventually an executive editor and a Vp executive editor

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Shelly Bond: only to walk the plank after 2 years on the job.

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Shelly Bond: Which you know was humiliating.

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Tad Eggleston: Right, and yet.

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Shelly Bond: I saw it coming, which always makes it easier when you're waving goodbye. So

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Shelly Bond: I share not only highlights from the books that I edited at Vertigo in that

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Shelly Bond: 16 year period which includes Gerard Way's Young Animal, which was

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Shelly Bond: a hell of a way to exit

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Shelly Bond: a company. I mean. What an accomplishment for Gerard and team.

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Tad Eggleston: Those are some of my son's favorite books.

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Shelly Bond: Super special person. Don't think of him as a rock star. I think of him, and have always thought of him as a powerhouse of creativity

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Shelly Bond: as a writer, artist, and just as a collaborator, just a true champion of the form and a hell of a great person. So

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Shelly Bond: secret histories of some of those projects, including the makes line, which was DC. Comics. Very 1st

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Shelly Bond: young adult imprint

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Shelly Bond: that I pitched in. Oh, 3. So the origin story for that is fun, and it involves some artwork by one of your favorite artists and mine.

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Shelly Bond: You're going to say, Paul Pope, and I'm going to say Philip Bond.

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Tad Eggleston: Yeah, I was. I was. I was expecting it to be either Phil or China.

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Shelly Bond: Phil, it's either Philip or Paul Pope or Mike Allred.

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Shelly Bond: If I'm really being honest right now. However.

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Shelly Bond: the other part of this book is

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Shelly Bond: how to remain a respectable human in an industry

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Shelly Bond: that some people have cited as being in a perpetual dumpster fire, and I admit that I just made that up on the spot for you. But I really believe that because I.

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Tad Eggleston: I mean something that comes up a lot on this podcast. And and frankly, a lot of conversations. I have period is, how

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Tad Eggleston: how do you maintain good art when the separation between

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Shelly Bond: Art and artist.

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Tad Eggleston: Well, art and artists, but but but but between

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Tad Eggleston: artist and who's paying for it, I mean.

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Shelly Bond: Yeah.

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Tad Eggleston: We have fewer and fewer people that have the money to publish.

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Tad Eggleston: or, you know, to run publishing houses. You know it's 1 of those those.

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Tad Eggleston: And it's true in other industries, too, but but the more

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Tad Eggleston: the less competition there is, the less the less motivation there is for the people who are going out to to say, Oh, I want this, or I want that to actually take real risks

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Tad Eggleston: because they don't have to.

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Shelly Bond: And sadly, I think at the end of the day a lot of money is being thrown. At

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Shelly Bond: the same old quote, unquote, stereotypical dudes.

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Tad Eggleston: Yep.

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Shelly Bond: Like the same old.

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Shelly Bond: And.

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Tad Eggleston: That's exactly where I was going.

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Shelly Bond: For some reason, for some reason they think it's okay to take the money and run and announce these

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Shelly Bond: very small

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Shelly Bond: companies that are staffed by their friends and other men in comics, and have very few women on board, or have very few people on board with disparate points of view, and that was always the success of vertigo which I know that you realize, you know, vertigo. It could have been called portal, which was one of the names for the imprint, but it was Karen Berger's vision to hire

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Shelly Bond: editors with different points of view and different interests that were not Super Fanboys or fangirl or fan people

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Shelly Bond: not, fanatics about other things, and not.

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Tad Eggleston: Right.

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Shelly Bond: Comics and create

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Shelly Bond: stories with intent and gravitas. And I think that's where so many companies miss the mark. It's it's about people and their taste.

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Tad Eggleston: Certainly in the single issue comic

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Tad Eggleston: field. I think we're seeing more and more that that in the imprints at

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Tad Eggleston: publishing houses you see that at 1st second, you see that at

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Tad Eggleston: Maverick you see that at, you know. I mean, if you look at if you look beyond

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Tad Eggleston: the things that show up in your local comic stores and look at sales.

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Tad Eggleston: Look at sales throughout the entire book market. The best selling books are incredibly diverse right now.

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Tad Eggleston: Which just kind of makes it painful for some of us who who love

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Tad Eggleston: the monthly medium to see how slowly it is with catching up with the times.

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Shelly Bond: True. And listen. Let me just give some props to companies like Silver Sprocket, who are just wiping

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Shelly Bond: server. Sprockets doing good work

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Shelly Bond: are with everyone uncivilized. Amazing Maple Terrace dropped to my for that book, love advanced Guy.

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Shelly Bond: And really love what Tom is doing with his, with his company, you know, and take and take risks on the sickness and.

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Tad Eggleston: Right.

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Shelly Bond: He has a Matt Madden book out now that looks.

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Tad Eggleston: Yeah, 6 6 treasures of the spiral I had Matt on a couple weeks ago, you know, to talk about.

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Shelly Bond: I have to go back and listen to it, because Matt is like my hero.

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Tad Eggleston: Matt's, Matt's.

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Shelly Bond: And exercise.

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Tad Eggleston: Easy, awesome.

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Shelly Bond: It's just genius. I'm I'm all about the teaching tools, so can I just interject. Tell you, Tad, that

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Shelly Bond: I doppelganger is not only filled with all the stuff I told you about, but it also has a section called Follow my lead, which is all about

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Shelly Bond: hopefully giving you guys like people who want to make comics, or people who just actually like to deconstruct comics. A little bit of a prompt or procedure

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Shelly Bond: that may just help you winnow down your own ideas and finish.

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Shelly Bond: I mean, as a teacher I'm looking forward to. It is even just something to help kids with their essays. Yes, if I know anything about you, it's going to be enough about like the mindset of.

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Tad Eggleston: Break it down and make it work, and go.

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Shelly Bond: Yes, it's a very.

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Tad Eggleston: That's truly 100% specific to comics. Well.

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Shelly Bond: Absolutely. I mean, I think that's the whole thing. I mean, you know, you could read a hundred books about like you know the secrets to great writing, or you know how to

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Shelly Bond: create something novel length to me. The number one true editing crime is not finishing something, and it's usually because you come to the table with a lofty goal, and that's ridiculous.

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Shelly Bond: Make a Mini comic.

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Shelly Bond: Make a 1-page story gradually build up to the 3 or 4 page comic.

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Shelly Bond: and then go for a single issue. Don't come out.

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Tad Eggleston: Actually.

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Shelly Bond: Right. Don't come out of the gate thinking you're gonna do 100.

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Tad Eggleston: Absolutely are you? Are you at all a Ray Bradbury fan.

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Shelly Bond: You know not not.

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Tad Eggleston: If have you ever read his book, Zen, and the art of writing.

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Shelly Bond: I haven't, although.

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Tad Eggleston: Okay.

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Shelly Bond: Thought you were going to say, Zen, and the art of motorcycle maintenance which I have read.

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Tad Eggleston: Yeah, I read that one, too.

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Shelly Bond: Tell me about the the Bradbury box.

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Tad Eggleston: So the thing that you just made me think of is, he writes about

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Tad Eggleston: His routine is, he woke up in the morning, made toast in a pot of coffee

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Tad Eggleston: and wrote a short story.

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Tad Eggleston: Didn't do anything else until he was done with that short story. Yeah. And like the afternoons and whatnot were for correspondence and editing and whatnot, and and in in that essay he even

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Tad Eggleston: cops to the fact that he's like some people have figured it out already.

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Tad Eggleston: but like for those that haven't, most of my novels are just cobbled together. Short stories.

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Shelly Bond: Well, that's and that's great advice. Because I again, I think that it's a huge problem. And just when I, when I talk to people at conventions who say they've been working on their comic for 3 years, and and my response to them is, Well, where is it? Oh, well, it's a long comic. It's like, Well, don't do that

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Shelly Bond: writing a short story or writing a 1 page comic like a hey amateur comic. And I know you're familiar with that.

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Tad Eggleston: I love, hey! Amateur.

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Shelly Bond: It's the way to jump. Start your idea. So if you can write a short short story, and maybe the short story is really just the one scene

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Shelly Bond: that has to be in your comic, whether it's 6 pages or 60 pages. Write that one scene 1st that got you here

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Shelly Bond: because you might forget it if you're gonna spend years writing a 20 page comic.

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Shelly Bond: The only way we were able to publish

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Shelly Bond: monthly comics when I was at vertigo. And let's not forget that my claim to fame was fables at 150 issues.

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Shelly Bond: and it was capped there, as far as I'm concerned, because we had a hustle.

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Shelly Bond: and I had to get Bill Willingham to write regularly, and I had to schedule fill-ins when sometimes the art teams got sick, or people, you know, we ran into problems. So I had to have some

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Shelly Bond: pretty good plan, B, and plan C

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Shelly Bond: to ask you a random question about fables that, like.

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Tad Eggleston: Fables felt like it was done at 75, and then it kept going. Was it supposed to be? Was it one of those things where it was

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Tad Eggleston: it was planned for for a shorter length than it was selling? Or or was the whole thing kind of there? What?

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Tad Eggleston: Well, because 75 was kind of the end of that 1st big epic.

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Shelly Bond: Yeah. Well, I can tell you that Bill

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Shelly Bond: pitched me that series as an ongoing series that could probably run for years and years and years, and I knew that because I knew Bill's work and I thought he was really in it.

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Shelly Bond: and he was serious.

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Shelly Bond: And I got him the right creative team or team members.

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Shelly Bond: We could do it. And Jeanette Khan agreed with us, because there was always that idea that

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Shelly Bond: well, it's fairy tales, you know, and so it it already has a built in audience. But we've got to make it unique enough

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Shelly Bond: that people will say, Hey, I didn't think of it in that way, and I think that that was the genius of Fables is that Bill came in

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Shelly Bond: not only with

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Shelly Bond: Snow, White and Bigby Wolf, as 2 very disparate characters who were different from their original Disneyfied persona.

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Shelly Bond: Just the idea that

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Shelly Bond: Big B or the big bad Wolf had a smoke to keep his wolf-like characteristics under wraps.

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Shelly Bond: so he can appear in the modern world as somewhat human.

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Shelly Bond: But Bill also set up some challenges for himself that his character is actually, as you know.

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Shelly Bond: fought with him about, and the characters won, because from the very beginning. And I talk about this in, I doppelganger. But I'm giving this straight to you

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Shelly Bond: from the very beginning. Bill said to me

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Shelly Bond: that he said shelly, I know you're gonna want Snow and Bigby to fall in love. And it's not gonna happen

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Shelly Bond: because it happened on moonlighting, which was a terrific sitcom in the late eighties Sybil Shepherd and Bruce Willis, when they let those characters fall in love. They were like a pair of investigators

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Shelly Bond: when they allowed them to fall in love. The show went under.

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Shelly Bond: and it was canceled. So Bill read me the Riot Act even before I said.

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Shelly Bond: is there going to be romance and fables? He said to me, no, not with these characters. And then, sure enough.

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Shelly Bond: storybook love.

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Shelly Bond: So you get the true story about fables.

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Shelly Bond: But the answer is, no.

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Shelly Bond: Bill told me from the beginning that

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Shelly Bond: Sandman reached 75 again at the time of, you know, making fun in the early 2 thousands, and he said he wanted to beat Neil, so, as he said I wanted to be 76 issues, but he was kidding. He really wanted to double lap, Neil.

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Shelly Bond: and he did what you do. Now. I'm so

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Shelly Bond: super proud of that original run, the one.

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Tad Eggleston: I.

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Shelly Bond: I've had a.

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Tad Eggleston: Questions stuck in my head since the beginning of the episode. So we're going to circle back a little bit because.

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Shelly Bond: Oh, goody!

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Tad Eggleston: I am in.

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Tad Eggleston: We're going back to art by lid. But specifically, you said you found her on Instagram and and I,

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Tad Eggleston: which is exactly how how to find artists today, but but I'm

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Tad Eggleston: so many people get set in in their own way of scouting one of the things that's always impressed me about you is you have adapted with

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Tad Eggleston: comics and with the Times, and what's best talk to me about because you found

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Tad Eggleston: new and up and coming creators at every stage of your career. Talk to me about how that process has changed.

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Shelly Bond: Well.

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Shelly Bond: it's a whole lot easier now. But I say to people, even back in the day you had to roll up your sleeves and dig for it. So I'd go to

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Shelly Bond: Saint Mark's comics on the weekends, and I would go through the stacks, or I'd go to Hanley's Universe in New York. I found Becky Cloonan's Mini comics in Hanley's universe, and Raina Telgemeyer smile long before it became, you know, a huge bestseller. It was a mini comic, and I loved it because I also had trouble with my teeth

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Shelly Bond: when I was small, even younger than Raina, because I walked in front of a swing set.

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Shelly Bond: which I think you might know about, because, you know, summer camp stories. So I was.

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Tad Eggleston: Please please tell me that you're going to finish that one day.

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Shelly Bond: Oh, it's finished!

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Tad Eggleston: Know you had big plans, and I.

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Shelly Bond: Well, that that's finished, and that is gonna come out in the spring. And Liz Prince.

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Tad Eggleston: I don't. I don't know if I can get that. No, not quite. I have your hack pack sticker on on my laptop right here.

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Shelly Bond: Oh, nice!

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Tad Eggleston: So.

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Shelly Bond: I love it. No, I believe you. I believe you and I know your listeners can't see this. But have you seen

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Shelly Bond: the doll?

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Tad Eggleston: If not.

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Shelly Bond: Well.

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Shelly Bond: this doll is going to be part of the Kickstarter for the trade paperback that comes out next spring, just in time for Camp

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Shelly Bond: 120.

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Tad Eggleston: Okay.

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Shelly Bond: Liz Prince just finished the last pages 2 weeks ago. So yes, I've been working on that, too. But to get back to to answer.

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Tad Eggleston: Well, when that Kickstarter goes live, you have to actually bring Liz Prince this time.

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Shelly Bond: I will! I I promise I will.

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Tad Eggleston: Because because I love Liz Prince. I loved Liz Prince before she was drawing your comics.

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Shelly Bond: Oh, yeah, of course, Tom Mechie Liz is right.

369
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Tad Eggleston: Well, and and I've got, I think the 1st thing I read from her was actually her. Her collection of punk, rock comics.

370
00:31:38.510 --> 00:31:52.779
Shelly Bond: Oh, yeah, those are great. I've been a huge fan of Liz's work forever. But just to get back to your scouting question. So you know the bottom line, though, is that I think a lot of people are lazy. I think you get to a point where you're comfortable with

371
00:31:53.060 --> 00:32:01.919
Shelly Bond: a coterie of artists and writers who do great work for you, and I think it's easy to get lazy. But anyone with eyeballs

372
00:32:02.040 --> 00:32:03.440
Shelly Bond: who is not

373
00:32:03.980 --> 00:32:10.929
Shelly Bond: pounding the pavements to be inspired by the next generation of artists isn't a true editor of my book.

374
00:32:11.170 --> 00:32:15.559
Shelly Bond: and I know that means I'm like really dissing a lot of people out there. But

375
00:32:15.760 --> 00:32:19.120
Shelly Bond: come on, people, I mean, we have.

376
00:32:19.120 --> 00:32:20.150
Tad Eggleston: Good ones.

377
00:32:20.150 --> 00:32:20.759
Shelly Bond: We have an option.

378
00:32:20.760 --> 00:32:22.069
Tad Eggleston: This, and the good ones.

379
00:32:23.210 --> 00:32:37.119
Shelly Bond: I honestly think I'm going to get political again. But I think my generation dropped the ball in comics. We have an obligation to the next generation to do better. You know, we spent the past 15 years going from

380
00:32:37.410 --> 00:32:46.449
Shelly Bond: female empowerment at these companies. You know, Jeanette Kahn left DC. Comics, and honestly, I feel like the walls caved in and crumbled

381
00:32:46.600 --> 00:32:59.289
Shelly Bond: at that point, and sometimes it gets better, you know, like you said, there are certainly some companies for a second, among many others that are have a lot of women, and they're doing some really good books and a lot of

382
00:32:59.350 --> 00:33:08.829
Shelly Bond: gender neutral people and people with different points of view, and and some men who are creating great comics. I'm not trying to be sexist or have a gender bias, but.

383
00:33:08.830 --> 00:33:09.699
Tad Eggleston: Alright, shit.

384
00:33:09.910 --> 00:33:14.770
Shelly Bond: Come on people. We could have been so much further along than we are.

385
00:33:14.790 --> 00:33:22.510
Shelly Bond: And a lot of things have happened in comics, including women quitting comics because of sexual harassment.

386
00:33:23.150 --> 00:33:28.740
Shelly Bond: all kinds of other things, not just in the companies, but in these

387
00:33:28.890 --> 00:33:33.189
Shelly Bond: areas that are adjacent to comics, where

388
00:33:33.210 --> 00:33:45.449
Shelly Bond: we should do better because we know better. So that's what I'm hoping I do without a doppelganger. It's not a bittersweet. Tell all because who wants a whiny retrospective. It's about

389
00:33:45.730 --> 00:33:51.660
Shelly Bond: stepping up putting lessons learned on the page.

390
00:33:51.680 --> 00:34:13.880
Shelly Bond: working with artists, some artists that you're going to know and love like Mark Buckingham, David Hahn, who did such a great body of work for vertigo. Not just for me, but Bike Club was such a favorite. So you're going to see a couple of artists who, you remember, from those years. But you're mostly going to see art by lid, and Imogen Mangle, and a couple of other people

391
00:34:13.980 --> 00:34:16.639
Shelly Bond: dotted across the book

392
00:34:16.690 --> 00:34:29.820
Shelly Bond: whose work really inspired me. And so when I tell you that I had to find something for art by lid, when my eyeballs interacted with her amazing Instagram work.

393
00:34:30.730 --> 00:34:51.400
Shelly Bond: I went right to 20 records 20 days which became record thieves like us because it was written, and I couldn't wait to work with her as soon as possible. So that's what needs to happen. 99% of the time when you see art, it should kick you in the face and say, Hey, write something for me, or get me a writer.

394
00:34:51.540 --> 00:34:57.190
Shelly Bond: and let's meet on the page through comics, the ultimate art form mic. Drop.

395
00:34:59.980 --> 00:35:07.150
Shelly Bond: If I make you laugh, Tad, after a a really hard week of teaching, and I made you laugh like that mission.

396
00:35:07.150 --> 00:35:13.789
Tad Eggleston: I've yeah, absolutely. I've been. This has been part of what's gotten me through the last few days.

397
00:35:14.220 --> 00:35:19.570
Tad Eggleston: Knowing that I I had this waiting oh.

398
00:35:20.960 --> 00:35:28.000
Tad Eggleston: give me one out of the 20. Don't! Don't! Obviously I can't ask you for all of them. But give me one song out of the 20.

399
00:35:28.233 --> 00:35:28.699
Shelly Bond: It's a.

400
00:35:28.700 --> 00:35:29.869
Tad Eggleston: 1 1 album.

401
00:35:29.870 --> 00:35:35.269
Shelly Bond: Record. Sometimes I can't decide, and I'm and I cheat.

402
00:35:35.410 --> 00:35:36.130
Shelly Bond: Yeah.

403
00:35:36.130 --> 00:35:36.630
Tad Eggleston: Yeah, yeah.

404
00:35:36.630 --> 00:35:37.990
Shelly Bond: Records. But

405
00:35:38.950 --> 00:35:49.640
Shelly Bond: I'll give you. I'll give you one. But I'm also going to give you my greatest regret, and I'm paying for it in such a big way. And so is Philip, because I cannot stop listening to pulps

406
00:35:49.650 --> 00:35:53.219
Shelly Bond: his and hers, which is my favorite pop album.

407
00:35:53.300 --> 00:36:01.169
Shelly Bond: And I think right now. It's my favorite album. Next to Suede's Dog Man Star, and Bowie's Diamond dogs.

408
00:36:01.330 --> 00:36:04.160
Shelly Bond: That's my perfect trifecta.

409
00:36:04.580 --> 00:36:06.529
Shelly Bond: You let me have 3 albums

410
00:36:06.610 --> 00:36:09.589
Shelly Bond: to take with me into my coffin.

411
00:36:09.980 --> 00:36:13.410
Shelly Bond: Those are the albums, but one of the.

412
00:36:14.350 --> 00:36:16.909
Tad Eggleston: Those are good good set of albums.

413
00:36:16.910 --> 00:36:17.440
Tad Eggleston: Yeah.

414
00:36:17.440 --> 00:36:17.950
Tad Eggleston: Canada.

415
00:36:17.950 --> 00:36:25.290
Shelly Bond: What are your 3? Give me 3. Give me 3 before I answer your question. My 3 kind of answered your question, anyway, because.

416
00:36:25.510 --> 00:36:30.389
Tad Eggleston: See, I'm I'm ridiculously eclectic. So my 3 are like.

417
00:36:32.590 --> 00:36:33.559
Shelly Bond: Go on!

418
00:36:34.815 --> 00:36:35.840
Tad Eggleston: Probably.

419
00:36:35.840 --> 00:36:36.260
Shelly Bond: I know.

420
00:36:36.260 --> 00:36:38.630
Tad Eggleston: Jungle, by Ellington.

421
00:36:39.180 --> 00:36:40.639
Shelly Bond: It's hard to choose.

422
00:36:41.110 --> 00:36:43.909
Tad Eggleston: Money Jungle by Ellington.

423
00:36:43.910 --> 00:36:44.680
Shelly Bond: Okay.

424
00:36:45.300 --> 00:36:47.420
Tad Eggleston: Abbey Road by the Beatles.

425
00:36:47.750 --> 00:36:50.540
Shelly Bond: Hmm! I'm more of a kinks fan, but go on.

426
00:36:50.890 --> 00:36:56.080
Tad Eggleston: I'm more of. I'm at least as much of a kinks fan. But the second side of Abbey Road

427
00:36:56.350 --> 00:37:00.489
Tad Eggleston: is is near perfection as anybody's ever come on an album side.

428
00:37:00.870 --> 00:37:01.200
Shelly Bond: Interesting.

429
00:37:01.630 --> 00:37:04.040
Shelly Bond: We'll debate that some other time.

430
00:37:04.120 --> 00:37:05.689
Tad Eggleston: The the 1st side

431
00:37:05.940 --> 00:37:10.770
Tad Eggleston: has its ups and downs, but the second side I can listen to over and over and over again.

432
00:37:12.370 --> 00:37:15.230
Shelly Bond: I feel that way about help his and hers.

433
00:37:15.370 --> 00:37:19.829
Shelly Bond: and you're going to say to yourself, how in the world could you not put it in your book?

434
00:37:19.960 --> 00:37:22.609
Shelly Bond: I ask myself the same question every.

435
00:37:22.610 --> 00:37:26.689
Tad Eggleston: Just means that you've got an excuse to do like an Instagram comic.

436
00:37:26.810 --> 00:37:32.120
Tad Eggleston: Join join the the join the revolution, put it out for free.

437
00:37:33.690 --> 00:37:34.870
Shelly Bond: I have an idea.

438
00:37:35.460 --> 00:37:37.840
Tad Eggleston: Have Philip, draw it.

439
00:37:40.000 --> 00:37:42.510
Shelly Bond: Your 3.rd Did you? Did you mention 3 or just 2.

440
00:37:42.510 --> 00:37:47.140
Tad Eggleston: No, the my 3rd is probably no code by the beetle or by pearl jam.

441
00:37:47.810 --> 00:37:48.300
Shelly Bond: All right.

442
00:37:48.300 --> 00:37:54.919
Tad Eggleston: So so Ellington, Ellington, the Beatles and Pearl Gem, if I'm doing 3 right now.

443
00:37:54.920 --> 00:37:59.860
Tad Eggleston: Well, Phillip, Philip refuses to have a favorite anything, by the way, and he thinks it's.

444
00:38:00.690 --> 00:38:01.980
Shelly Bond: For the very reason that I.

445
00:38:01.980 --> 00:38:03.809
Tad Eggleston: Change all over the time. Yeah.

446
00:38:03.810 --> 00:38:15.329
Shelly Bond: No, that's it. But see, that's why I call that book a follow. My lead prompt because you need to do it, anyway. And yes, I'm regretting it. Of course I am, and and I know the exact

447
00:38:15.630 --> 00:38:17.990
Shelly Bond: album I want to pick out of there.

448
00:38:18.130 --> 00:38:19.110
Tad Eggleston: Yes, it's easy.

449
00:38:19.110 --> 00:38:23.310
Tad Eggleston: See the key, the key, Shelly is not to regret it. Just make another list.

450
00:38:23.310 --> 00:38:24.270
Shelly Bond: It's true.

451
00:38:24.470 --> 00:38:38.239
Tad Eggleston: My son and I used to make lists like every every time we got together for dinner. One of us would have a prompt, and we just make lists. And then when that list was done, it was like, Oh, but I forgot to do this. So now we're going to do a list of this.

452
00:38:38.670 --> 00:38:42.679
Shelly Bond: That's the whole thing. I think a lot of people have a fear

453
00:38:43.060 --> 00:38:50.180
Shelly Bond: of making a comic, or making a list, or making a a mix or a soundtrack

454
00:38:50.450 --> 00:38:55.260
Shelly Bond: and forgetting things, and almost like it's. It's a way

455
00:38:55.300 --> 00:39:02.350
Shelly Bond: to convince yourself that you're not ready to release your personal best out into the world, and we have.

456
00:39:02.350 --> 00:39:14.379
Tad Eggleston: It's kind of like when you're traveling, and and you feel like you have to run from place to place to place to place, because you don't want to miss this while you're there, and and then you don't enjoy any of it, because.

457
00:39:14.380 --> 00:39:14.890
Shelly Bond: Right.

458
00:39:14.890 --> 00:39:19.949
Tad Eggleston: You're just running around. I remember the 1st time my wife and I traveled together, and she was like

459
00:39:20.300 --> 00:39:22.839
Tad Eggleston: she was used to the family trips where they went.

460
00:39:22.890 --> 00:39:29.579
Tad Eggleston: Boom! Boom! We we got okay. We're here now. We got to go because we don't want to miss this, and it closes it, and I just said.

461
00:39:29.610 --> 00:39:36.120
Tad Eggleston: You know I just assume that like if I don't see it, that's an excuse to come back.

462
00:39:36.530 --> 00:39:40.350
Tad Eggleston: and if I don't come back. It means I didn't care about seeing it that much.

463
00:39:40.820 --> 00:39:50.839
Shelly Bond: So that's so right. I think that I, as I recall vacations with my family, the best times when you were just allowed to like hang out in the hotel room and like, just have a

464
00:39:51.070 --> 00:39:51.769
Shelly Bond: you know, and.

465
00:39:51.770 --> 00:39:52.240
Tad Eggleston: Yeah.

466
00:39:52.240 --> 00:39:56.800
Shelly Bond: See and and raid the Mini bar, not of booze, but of like.

467
00:39:56.800 --> 00:40:04.960
Tad Eggleston: Like ex exploring the the local diners is one of my favorite things to do, or you know.

468
00:40:04.960 --> 00:40:10.810
Shelly Bond: See who has the best French fries. They gotta be steak, Tad. They have to be well done.

469
00:40:11.010 --> 00:40:14.070
Shelly Bond: almost burned to a crisp where I'm not eating them.

470
00:40:14.260 --> 00:40:17.390
Tad Eggleston: Okay. There's a place near me that you'd like a lot.

471
00:40:17.390 --> 00:40:19.829
Shelly Bond: All right. I'll have to.

472
00:40:19.830 --> 00:40:22.860
Tad Eggleston: Next time you're in Chicago I'll bring you up to the north. Burbs.

473
00:40:22.860 --> 00:40:25.630
Shelly Bond: You know it might happen. You never know.

474
00:40:26.810 --> 00:40:29.309
Tad Eggleston: A couple of conventions around here

475
00:40:29.660 --> 00:40:37.830
Tad Eggleston: think I think, 2, 2 big ones, and a and a and a like small press con. Every year in Chicago.

476
00:40:38.150 --> 00:40:42.269
Tad Eggleston: There's another small press Comp. Up in Milwaukee every year.

477
00:40:42.270 --> 00:40:42.670
Shelly Bond: Nice.

478
00:40:42.670 --> 00:40:47.839
Tad Eggleston: They might have a bigger one, but I don't pay as much attention to the big ones. I like the small press ones.

479
00:40:47.840 --> 00:40:52.540
Shelly Bond: Get me an invite. You know. We were asked to to go to Genghis Khan this past.

480
00:40:52.540 --> 00:40:53.180
Tad Eggleston: Yeah.

481
00:40:53.180 --> 00:41:07.449
Shelly Bond: Blast in Cleveland, and all it took was one extremely convincing, amazing artist named Sequoia Bostic, who runs the show? She asked nicely. And we said, Okay.

482
00:41:07.580 --> 00:41:12.009
Shelly Bond: and we were there, and I would love to go back. It was a really great time.

483
00:41:14.650 --> 00:41:16.707
Tad Eggleston: Very, very cool. What was your

484
00:41:17.360 --> 00:41:19.669
Tad Eggleston: Favorite part of Cleveland?

485
00:41:21.500 --> 00:41:28.609
Shelly Bond: Oh, that's gonna be tough. We stayed in a terrific place. There's a Residency at Zygot Press.

486
00:41:28.790 --> 00:41:34.059
Shelly Bond: which is a printing company that just supports the arts community.

487
00:41:34.280 --> 00:41:40.480
Shelly Bond: They were kind enough to donate their space to Philip and I to stay in the facility.

488
00:41:40.510 --> 00:41:49.970
Shelly Bond: So have been like, you know, printing Zines all night, and I wish I would have done that. But I was so exhausted just from working the convention

489
00:41:50.510 --> 00:41:55.739
Shelly Bond: that it was just, you know, lights out, but it was that it was playing pinball.

490
00:41:56.080 --> 00:41:59.039
Shelly Bond: which I hear you're quite the fan of pinball.

491
00:41:59.350 --> 00:42:06.910
Tad Eggleston: Well, I have played pinball and like, now that I know it's a thing in Ohio, I want to make certain that I like

492
00:42:07.200 --> 00:42:15.219
Tad Eggleston: play for the 1st time in like 2 decades the next time up in the State, and or figure out if there's a pinball place in Chicago. But, like.

493
00:42:15.220 --> 00:42:17.039
Shelly Bond: Oh, there must be! It's the.

494
00:42:17.040 --> 00:42:18.339
Tad Eggleston: There must be, but.

495
00:42:18.340 --> 00:42:20.139
Shelly Bond: It's the new Karaoke.

496
00:42:20.140 --> 00:42:26.890
Tad Eggleston: That's what it seems like. It's what it seems like, you know. For that matter, my friend Katie went from the Karaoke party at

497
00:42:27.790 --> 00:42:33.609
Tad Eggleston: cartoon crossroads to play pinball before going back to her hotel.

498
00:42:33.610 --> 00:42:38.539
Shelly Bond: Did she have an a pinball injury? I actually bruised.

499
00:42:38.540 --> 00:42:43.900
Tad Eggleston: Bruce your thumb? Well, you know, I mean she plays in a league, so I imagine she's built up calluses.

500
00:42:43.900 --> 00:42:44.380
Shelly Bond: Yeah.

501
00:42:44.380 --> 00:42:45.820
Tad Eggleston: I'll have to ask her.

502
00:42:45.820 --> 00:42:51.599
Tad Eggleston: Okay. I was embarrassed, but I was not gonna let jaws.

503
00:42:51.610 --> 00:43:01.489
Shelly Bond: Defeat me. I played the jaws pinball machine, which you know I'm old enough to remember when jaws came out and scared the life out of me in the theater.

504
00:43:01.820 --> 00:43:07.379
Shelly Bond: which I should not have been taken to see that movie. But thank you, mom and dad, you're crazy. People.

505
00:43:07.720 --> 00:43:09.599
Tad Eggleston: See jaws always.

506
00:43:10.500 --> 00:43:12.799
Tad Eggleston: The thing that jaws makes me think about

507
00:43:12.990 --> 00:43:20.579
Tad Eggleston: the most is how sometimes the best things are happy accidents that you allow to happen.

508
00:43:20.740 --> 00:43:30.310
Tad Eggleston: because the power of that movie is how long it takes to see the shark, and the only reason it takes that long to see the shark is because they couldn't make the shark work.

509
00:43:30.310 --> 00:43:58.400
Tad Eggleston: It was supposed to show up in like the 1st minutes of the film, but they were having ridiculous amounts of trouble with the mechanical shark, so they just kept rewriting it and rewriting it to work around the fact that the shark wasn't working. If they decided that they had to shoot, you know, if they had. If they'd had somebody say that they could go over budget because they needed to wait until they could get. You know there are a million ways where they decide that they have to stick to the script, and it winds up, not being as good.

510
00:43:58.470 --> 00:44:03.539
Tad Eggleston: But instead, they're like, Okay, we got to work with what we've got.

511
00:44:03.540 --> 00:44:10.530
Shelly Bond: Yup. Well, that's what it is a constraint when when a problem comes up, and this is also

512
00:44:10.560 --> 00:44:15.979
Shelly Bond: believe it or not, I'm gonna tie it back to. I Doppelganger, because

513
00:44:16.360 --> 00:44:27.590
Shelly Bond: there are certain words that I throw out in the book that I think are important to anyone who wants to get ahead in life or in making comics. And one of those words is pivot.

514
00:44:27.640 --> 00:44:31.130
Shelly Bond: because when things are thrown at you, whether they're

515
00:44:32.020 --> 00:44:35.589
Shelly Bond: banana peels, or whether it's ink in the face.

516
00:44:35.790 --> 00:44:46.650
Shelly Bond: You just sometimes have to pivot and go to plan B. And so that's what I guess they did on on the set of jaws. And what did that do that created and heightened the suspense.

517
00:44:46.870 --> 00:44:47.230
Tad Eggleston: Yep.

518
00:44:47.230 --> 00:44:54.349
Shelly Bond: The fear that everyone in that audience had, whether in the theater or watching it from their couch

519
00:44:54.390 --> 00:45:16.500
Shelly Bond: or reading the book, for that matter, because I remember my mom read a lot of books, and then we went to see the movies. And you know they were terrifying because a lot of that was in your head, and the suspense grows in your head. But to get it on film like how amazing is that? That's what I love about monthly comics and comics that you make quickly. You don't have time to worry.

520
00:45:16.700 --> 00:45:26.399
Shelly Bond: Is it perfect? What will people think? This isn't my best work? Well, you know what it probably isn't. But finish it, anyway, so you can get on to the next comic.

521
00:45:27.950 --> 00:45:28.760
Shelly Bond: urgent art.

522
00:45:28.760 --> 00:45:29.300
Tad Eggleston: But

523
00:45:29.550 --> 00:45:41.350
Tad Eggleston: before before we hit my wrap up question, I'm gonna you said constraint. And and it reminded me of something that we touched on earlier. Matt Madden's new book is all about comics made

524
00:45:41.580 --> 00:45:51.519
Tad Eggleston: with a particular constraint. Each comic he started with, this is going to be in this poetic form, or this is going to be.

525
00:45:52.120 --> 00:45:56.970
Tad Eggleston: you know, using this or not, using that or whatever.

526
00:45:56.970 --> 00:45:58.170
Shelly Bond: Amount of panels.

527
00:45:58.340 --> 00:46:08.830
Tad Eggleston: Right, though generally even weirder than that, you know, there's there's there's 1 there's 1 where every panel has to be has to like resemble a letter.

528
00:46:09.260 --> 00:46:09.780
Shelly Bond: Oh, nice!

529
00:46:09.780 --> 00:46:10.270
Tad Eggleston: Where you had to.

530
00:46:10.270 --> 00:46:11.920
Shelly Bond: I can't wait to get this book.

531
00:46:11.920 --> 00:46:14.469
Tad Eggleston: Oh, it's so so good!

532
00:46:14.490 --> 00:46:19.359
Tad Eggleston: It's available now. 6 treasures of the spiral comics formed under pressure

533
00:46:19.410 --> 00:46:21.829
Tad Eggleston: from uncivilized press. So you know.

534
00:46:22.680 --> 00:46:27.990
Shelly Bond: Please check it out because Mad Matt creates some terrific teaching tools. My favorite.

535
00:46:27.990 --> 00:46:28.460
Tad Eggleston: Yeah.

536
00:46:28.460 --> 00:46:32.339
Shelly Bond: Using my comics editing class at Portland State. Drum Roll.

537
00:46:32.520 --> 00:46:38.490
Shelly Bond: Shaking the tambourine is 99 exercises in style.

538
00:46:38.800 --> 00:46:39.480
Tad Eggleston: Right?

539
00:46:39.790 --> 00:46:41.800
Tad Eggleston: 99 ways to tell a story.

540
00:46:41.800 --> 00:46:42.820
Shelly Bond: Exactly. That's.

541
00:46:42.820 --> 00:46:48.970
Tad Eggleston: I also love drawing, drawing words, and writing pictures.

542
00:46:49.220 --> 00:46:51.970
Shelly Bond: Right, which is the textbook, that.

543
00:46:51.970 --> 00:46:53.269
Tad Eggleston: Book for their class.

544
00:46:53.270 --> 00:46:53.860
Shelly Bond: Like.

545
00:46:54.290 --> 00:46:55.510
Tad Eggleston: With, Jessica, yeah.

546
00:46:55.510 --> 00:47:01.930
Shelly Bond: Jessica. I but I do have to dash so. I can't wait for this last question.

547
00:47:01.930 --> 00:47:02.939
Tad Eggleston: Here it is.

548
00:47:03.750 --> 00:47:06.979
Tad Eggleston: Give me something that you love.

549
00:47:07.090 --> 00:47:14.520
Tad Eggleston: that not enough people have experienced, and you need them to. So you can talk to them about it, preferably comics. But you know you like lots of stuff. So whatever.

550
00:47:16.070 --> 00:47:17.030
Shelly Bond: Wow!

551
00:47:17.360 --> 00:47:20.977
Shelly Bond: That's a great wrap up question.

552
00:47:21.740 --> 00:47:30.070
Shelly Bond: I was going to say pulp his and hers, because I feel like I dissed Jarvis in the biggest way, but I've already talked about that too much, so don't count that.

553
00:47:30.820 --> 00:47:33.689
Tad Eggleston: It'll be in the show notes, anyway. It's just not in this part.

554
00:47:33.910 --> 00:47:39.339
Shelly Bond: Well, yeah, it's it's a tough thing. I will say that

555
00:47:40.070 --> 00:47:47.250
Shelly Bond: my favorite John Allison comic is one that isn't easy to find.

556
00:47:47.420 --> 00:48:01.249
Shelly Bond: and it's called expecting to fly, and it's a two-parter, and it features his characters from scary go round, which are his MoD characters. Can you believe it? I love his MoD. You know, nineties

557
00:48:01.260 --> 00:48:08.979
Shelly Bond: growing up in Sheffield characters who who love Britpop music. Can you imagine me liking something like that?

558
00:48:10.550 --> 00:48:15.949
Shelly Bond: Not really right? So I will share that with readers, because sometimes

559
00:48:16.140 --> 00:48:19.360
Shelly Bond: you can find that comic on Gumroad and.

560
00:48:19.360 --> 00:48:22.870
Tad Eggleston: Well, I was about to say it is on Gum Road right now.

561
00:48:22.870 --> 00:48:27.750
Shelly Bond: Great name name, a fair price, this comic.

562
00:48:28.130 --> 00:48:32.489
Shelly Bond: which I actually have 2 copies of because I went and like

563
00:48:32.860 --> 00:48:49.080
Shelly Bond: tracked it down, which again, is one of the greatest joys I miss so much about that search for the perfect record or the search for the perfect comic. You can find things, either real quickly, just Google searching and then maybe going on ebay.

564
00:48:49.790 --> 00:49:06.639
Shelly Bond: but tracking something down. The thrill of the quest is something that I really wish that more people would remember A. They love doing, and B do it again. But that's the book that I recommend to people, because that two-parter, I think, is a perfect two-parter, and I hope that.

565
00:49:06.640 --> 00:49:09.950
Tad Eggleston: They are both available on Gumroad right now.

566
00:49:10.140 --> 00:49:18.420
Tad Eggleston: so people can find them, and I will throw them in my my show notes, and I will likely have read them by the next time we talk, because, you know.

567
00:49:18.420 --> 00:49:25.559
Shelly Bond: Well, I'm going to actually bring it even more full circle, because John Allison draws a character named Lottie.

568
00:49:26.270 --> 00:49:35.150
Shelly Bond: who is my doppelganger, or I'd like to think she was when I had a thick black fringe and chin length Bob

569
00:49:35.520 --> 00:49:44.100
Shelly Bond: in the nineties, so I always tell John that Lottie is my doppelganger, but she is way cooler than I ever will be, or ever was. So

570
00:49:44.260 --> 00:49:58.490
Shelly Bond: there we go. We tie it back to Idoppelganger, which is on Kickstarter right now could really use some support. If you can't back it, I totally get it. We're all broke. But please share the campaign, because I really want to wrap up my.

571
00:49:58.490 --> 00:50:05.540
Tad Eggleston: Well. And and this is where I'll say, I mean, it's really easy to go really overboard, because you've got all sorts of cool stuff.

572
00:50:05.710 --> 00:50:08.679
Tad Eggleston: but digital copy for $18.

573
00:50:09.630 --> 00:50:21.799
Shelly Bond: Exactly. And it's at 176 pages. And remember, it's 50%. Me, my life in the 21st century editing comics, my tips and tricks. But it's also 50%.

574
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Shelly Bond: How you can step it up and level up your comics, give back to the community

575
00:50:27.330 --> 00:50:32.710
Shelly Bond: and just make comics and make your mark on history, Tad.

576
00:50:32.810 --> 00:50:36.030
Shelly Bond: it's never too late. I want to see you making more comics.

577
00:50:37.080 --> 00:50:50.619
Tad Eggleston: I'm all for people making more comics. I am all for people reading more comics. I'm all for more. Off register comics. Bring the tambourine some more.

578
00:50:50.620 --> 00:50:51.159
Shelly Bond: Ha! Ha! Ha!

579
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Tad Eggleston: And for Shelley Bond. This has been 22 panels. We will see you after the next page.